T O P

I hate small talk

I hate small talk

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JennyBeckman

He wasn't wrong for asking but he should've been prepared for that being a possible response. Interestingly, I've known a couple of Black Americans witjmh Irish surnames who assumed slavery was the answer when it was more likely to be willing miscegenation.


Kenshin220

When the Irish first came the america when they were treated like shit they were forced to live near black communities. A lot of that intermingling is why we have stereotypical black names like Tyrone. Tyrone is irish


Marshmlol

Tyrone is Irish? Holy crap. TIL


macaleaven

There is a whole country in Ireland called Tyrone my mate


MonsterRider80

*county


macaleaven

I dunno why predictive text decided to finesse me but yes that’s what I meant


DigNitty

Tbf there is a whole country in Ireland.


brosefstallin

O’Shea Jackson (Ice Cube)


Fairy_Squad_Mother

Boston and Baltimore are Irish towns too.


macaleaven

TIL there is a Boston that’s not in Lincolnshire or Massachusetts


ositola

Imagine Erykah Badu telling her ex to call his boy and a pale ginger dude roll up


MalakaiRey

Tyrone was a skinny Irish brother


Expat_mat

I thought he was a silly fat bastard.


MalakaiRey

Thats Terry. Fuckin Terry.


liqmahbalz

ya like dags?


Expat_mat

DAGS?


Boggie135

Perry winkle blue


liqmahbalz

it's fer me ma.


Boggie135

*It had previously occurred to me that the pikey had taken the demise of his mother rather lightly*


Boggie135

*Its too tight* *Too tight?! You can fit a fucking jumbo jet in there!*


nrag726

Stephen Tyrone Colbert


Dafuknboognish

A lot of the stereotypical names attributed to us originated like this. Leroy (Le Roy) is Norman/Normish origin from Denmark.


minahmyu

Jerome is.... Italian!


Mikey6304

The PBS show Finding Your Roots with Henry Louis Gates talks about this a lot. The Irish and Scotts were typically hired as overseers, this created a power imbalance that kept the oppressed whites in charge of oppressing the black slaves so the groups never rallied together. The stories about Irish and Scottish families living in harmony with black and native communities in the South are a myth told to white wash the history of slavery. I grew up with those same stories. https://www.npr.org/2019/01/21/686531998/historian-henry-louis-gates-jr-on-dna-testing-and-finding-his-own-roots Edit: Some deep dive reading if you're up for it https://aran.library.nuigalway.ie/bitstream/handle/10379/5437/Joe%20Regan%20Post%20Viva%20Thesis.pdf?sequence=1


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Mikey6304

Modern bluegrass did borrow some aspects of gospel, but it's really just rural American Irish/Scottish folk. It's also only really rooted in the early 1900s (1930s-1940s) as a genre.


busy_yogurt

Aw, hell no! That's the whitest music there is. (Bluegrass is Kentucky, Tennessee area) You might be thinking of Zydeco: "Cajun music and zydeco are closely related parallel music forms. Cajun music is the music of the white Cajuns of south Louisiana, while zydeco is the music of the black Creoles of the same region." I grew up in LA and Zydeco gives me life. Once you hear Cajun after that, *Cajun* sounds bluegrass. (Supposedly) the word Zydeco comes from a french saying: Someone would ask you how you are, and you'd answer "Les haricots something something." They were saying "The beans aren't salty," which is a way of answering "Not bad." "Les haricots" spoken in french became the word Zydeco.


irishusmc2232

This is such a good knowledge bomb. There are stories of Irish/Scottish indentured servants/prisoners/slaves and African slaves/prisoners becoming very close, marrying etc all over the world. Barbados, Haiti, Tasmania/Madagascar, but *not* in the US. I grew up thinking this cultural bond existed in the US as well, but was really bummed to learn that America was literally too racist, from top to bottom, for these kinds of connections. Slavery may not be rooted in racism over the entire course of history, but American slavery was 1000% based in deep seeded racial hatred of Africans. Thanks for sharing the links.


DaToof

You pretty much said it already, but I must reiterate: Chattel Slavery was 100% rooted in racism and is an remarkably foul system when compared to any and all of the "slavery always existed" examples championed by your standard Reddit contrarians.


Mikey6304

This was also true in Jamaica and Barbados. They intentionally hired/indentured the Irish to brutalize black slaves. there was no magical village of free slaves, irish, and natives blending cultures in Appalachia or the Blue Mountains. That is a folk tale to downplay the systemic rape that resulted in nearly all african americans carrying the uil neill haplotype.


roastplantain

Scottish overseers was some of the most brutal overseers. They also owned a lot of plantations. So the mixing between Scots and slaves was probably not consensual


Canesjags4life

Yeah briefly mentioned that in Judas and the Black Messiah


Cutieq85

Surprised there hell outta me when I first read “ Long Day’s Journey into Night” and realized it was supposed to be about White People lol.


Ill-Agent

It also explains red-haired, freckle-faced black people such as me.


HublotKingCole

Blake Griffin


19whale96

Sean


daemc3

Wow you just answered the question I’ve been asking forever, “why do I have an Irish last name” thanks


dregwriter

>Tyrone is irish # HOLY SHIT


foolie_winkims

Yup I also wanted to point out that Jerome is also a Jewish name in fact Jerry Seinfeld real name is actually Jerome and he's Jewish


swingthatwang

I'm sorry, but good god this comment is stupid. Just because ONE Jewish man is named "Jerome," does NOT mean that it is a Jewish name. Like wtf is this logic. Imagine if a famous Nigerian comedian is named John, and you assume John is a Nigerian name of Nigerian origin. At any rate, apparently it's Greek: > Jerome is a masculine name of Greek origin, derived from the Greek given name Ἱερώνυμος, Hierōnymos, "sacred name"; from ἱερός, hierós, "sacred", and ὄνυμα, ónyma, an alternative form of ὄνομα, ónoma, "name". It is the name of a prominent Christian saint, Saint Jerome, the translator of the Vulgate.


curlyfreak

Lots of Jewish ancestry in Latin America as well. Which is interesting but makes sense when you look at how the Catholics kicked all other religions out when they retook Spain from the Moors.


OpenContainerLaws

“My people were the white man’s....”


A_Naany_Mousse

Shaquille right?


JennyBeckman

The Irish were also all over the Caribbean so some mixing happened down there.


MissIndigoBonesaw

Honestly curious here: what would be an appropriate answer to that response?


Oshootman

"Oh, I see."


JennyBeckman

"That's rough, buddy."


mousemarie94

"Ah."


Not-The-AlQaeda

Finger guns


dr_shark

I've always hated the word: miscegenation. It actually has an interesting [history](https://www.alphadictionary.com/goodword/word/miscegenation).


JennyBeckman

Why would you hate the word? This was an interesting link.


dr_shark

The word in its construction was created to suggest interracial relations was wrong.


TooSmalley

Met a girl at a party with the same last name Smalley (I’m white and she was black) the host was all “crazy you guys have the same last name, I wondered if yall related”. I did an awkward laugh and desperately tried to change the conversation.


HexNveX

Oh wow, the floor here is made of floor.


Kalkaline

Although history has long forgotten them, Lambini and sons are generally credited with the Sistine Chapel floor.


PsyrusTheGreat

I'll tell you what though, it's not as clean as this floor. Nope.


Seal-zx

Best case scenario ur ancestors were regular slave owners worst case the host's statement was true


_the_chosen_juan_

A while back a coworker of mine found out I am biracial, half black half white. She asked me if I was related to Thomas Jefferson. I said no I don’t think so (strange question). She said “oh you know he used to have sex with all his slaves, right?” This bitch thought that because I’m mixed I might might actually be a descendent of Thomas Jefferson. Wtf. She was a well educated director at the company I was working for.


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goat_8675309

white dudes family once owned black dudes family


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TooSmalley

Unfortunately, my family knows. We had an in-law really in ancestry stuff who did a ton of research into it. Smalleys been on US soil since the early Plymouth colony days. Lots of ancestors who owned multiple acres of farmland, chances are very low they didn't employ slaves. The only good thing is they were mostly northerners and probably weren't the last people to free their slaves like the ones forced to in the south. Side note. One of my ancestors claim to fame is he killed [9 Indians in a canoe](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Dale) with 2 dudes during the Creek War of 1813-1814


ontrack

One of my family's claim to fame is that they were killed by natives one year after arriving in North Carolina from Germany in 1710. Only a 6 year old boy survived. Fortunately for me I guess.


LiquidBionix

have you been to a party


kkpetty

Had a white coworker continue to compliment my “nice Irish last name” after I already told her twice I wasn’t Irish and I had to hit her w a line just like this


AviatorOVR5000

What a weird compliment. I've complimented beautiful first names... But not last names. That feels like a signal he was trying to give you. Idk.


irishusmc2232

Yeah thats a big yikes.....this isn't a cool conversation point in America unfortunately. If you meet a black person from Barbados or Haiti or Madagascar (or the UK obviously) with an Irish name, there is a good chance it's because they're Irish. But if they are African American...shut the fuck up. American slavery was on such another level of racism that people don't even understand. And people respond with "slavery isn't based on racism". Sure. Slavery as a whole, across all of human history wasn't centered around racism (though it was heavily centered around the subjugation of a nation of people you just invaded, and I have reservations about how different those two even are to begin with), but AMERICAN slavery was *engineered* around racism and supremacy. Aside from being upsetting and offensive, remarks like this are really good at letting you know the person you're speaking to is ignorant as all hell. Sorry you have to deal with this kinda shit. 💚 Edit: screwing up sentences.


GodOfDarkLaughter

Having studied ancient history, I will tell anyone who'll listen that American chattel slavery of black Africans is the worst form of slavery to ever exist. If the choice came down to that or Ancient Rome, I'd do anything to get to Rome. The main reason being that in many ancient societies there were manumission (the freeing of enslaved peoples) rules and customs built into their laws and society. Sure, technically you could free a black slave in the US, but it was still an absolutely shit place to be *for the rest of your life.* Some made success, but the entire world was against them. It wasn't even uncommon for freedmen in ancient rome to become successful and powerful.


kstevens58

Hell, a former slave became a Roman Emperor. Imagine that happening in America, a freed slave becoming president. Not likely, nah.


fzyflwrchld

I had a very naive undergrad that told me he once asked his black American waitress where she was from and she said New Jersey and he was like "no, no. Where are you *from*? Like what country?" And I was like dude, wtf? What if she'd said she didn't know because her ancestors came over on a slave ship? Who asks that? I asked if she had an accent or anything that would've prompted him to inquire a country of origin and he said no. (Apparently she uncomfortably or awkwardly answered "Ghana? I think.") He thought it was perfectly normal. On the other hand, I'm half Asian, grew up Asian but look white and he refused to acknowledge that I was Asian cuz I look white and came to America as a child so "you're just American now", even though I know if he met a Mexican girl who came to America at the same age I did he wouldn't argue that she was no longer Mexican cuz she'd still *look* Mexican (or that waitress that was *born and raised* in America was still Ghanian). He once walked into the lab while I was talking to my mom on the phone in our language. Afterwards, he was like "It's cool that you can speak that." And I was like "yeah, it's cool that you can speak English." (I know it was a snarky reply, but to me it was clear he meant it like it's cool I can speak a foreign language...foreign to him, yes, but foreign to me, too, because he couldn't accept that I was Asian. So my intent was to show that it's not that cool to speak the language you grew up with.)


Mikazukinoyaiba

That undergrad sounds like an overall POS


fzyflwrchld

He was from upstate NY, he said, and didn't grow up with poc. So when he was finally exposed to them he was very, very excited to learn all about them and their culture. He was well-meaning but very ignorant about it. He pretty much saw every poc as a foreigner, not in a bad xenophobic way, but in just a dumb, naive way. And so on the backhand, anyone who looked white (me) was just a boring, everyday American. I think he was also a little sexist cuz he looked up a lot to the male post-doc and tried to emulate him but ignored the things me or the female post-doc told him to do. But culturally, he meant well, he was trying to learn even if he did do it clumsily. He had gone to India once and I think that got him really excited about other cultures. He fully immersed himself in the Indian culture while he was there and got really into yoga. He actually ended up moving to India to continue his studies there. It just annoyed me cuz my ethnic/cultural background and immigrant experience often get dismissed or ignored because I can pass as white and have no accent, but he was just so in-your-face about doing it. But I tried to remind myself that this was all new to him and he was just overenthusiastic about learning about poc and different cultures that he couldn't see past his own biases to put himself in their shoes cuz he had no experience to be able to do so yet. Hopefully, he'll grow wiser with age, especially living in foreign country.


busy_yogurt

>and didn't grow up with poc that's just sad, man.


motherofabeast

I lived in little valley NY for a year. Originally from Jersey and that shit was culture shock. The closest thing to a black person were the natives from the res and everyone was openly racist as fuck. It's like going back 60 years


Ezl

Where in Jersey? (BNR here).


motherofabeast

Down by AC.


Ezl

Ah, cool. I’m up in Hudson County.


motherofabeast

My family is from Paterson, but we moved down here like 30 years ago. Still have family up there


stabliu

Props to you for giving him the benefit of the doubt. I can’t stand shit like that, big part of why I felt so much more at home in the country my parents were born in than the US.


ThePoliteCanadian

He screams neo-liberal, white saviour complex. They’re almost worse because if you don’t baby them, and take every single fucking microaggression, they radicalize into racist neo nazis. Great. Thanks.


minahmyu

What pisses me off about that shit is, no one asks white folks where *they're from* especially when they don't have an accent from outta country. "Where are you *reeeally* from? Is that last name Polish with the -ski at the end?! You from Poland? Say hi in Polish! Can you count?!" What I usually get is where I'm from (in the US) because someone swears they saw someone who looked *just* like me so we're related! Despite not having any family in that area, they really doubt me. "You *suuuure* you don't have family in NYC?" Yes because they found my long lost family after one visit there and I'm just too stupid to know that. No I don't have family there!


moshmore

My mother took me to the tobacco plantation where her maiden name originated when I was 15. It was only a 45 min drive from our house in Virginia. The only thing that slightly surprised me was the fact that our family line hadn't moved very far away in all that time. But I guess they wouldn't have exactly had the best options in the world after slavery was abolished. My father's last name (mine as well) is of Anglo-Saxon origin, while my first name is of Slavic origin. I've had more than a few people (teachers, coworkers, friends, bank employees etc) ask me if I or one of my parents was from Europe or if I was adopted lol. Typically I'm asked if I'm Russian, and I always ask if they've ever met a black Russian before lol. Always gets a few laughs. The temptation to learn a little Russian just to mess with people is very high


unonameless

Did you know that the word "Slave" is derived from medieval Latin "sclava", the name of the southern Slavic tribes (sclaveni) that lived in the Balkans.


LuxNocte

Da Comrade. Dostoyevsky!


uberblack

I used to work with a dope ass chick who had a Slavic first name. Her dad was in the military when she was born and asked the locals for a name for his daughter.


sirfiddlestix

Do it! The universe os practically begging you it seems!


fatslayingdinosaur

I mean well yeah, I think some don't know that lots of enslaved people took their name after the plantation owner. Or are we going to forget roots and the name toby.


Wu-kandaForever

Pro football Hall of Fame, Walter Peyton Man of the Year recipient running back LaDainian Tomlinson’s family name is the name of the slave owner to his great great great grandfather, George Tomlinson. I learned this from his HoF acceptance speech in 2017. It’s actually a great speech if you want to check it out, he goes on about how something so horrible can be changed by all the amazing Tomlinsons his family has made. Man, that was not that long ago, and we have a long way to go.


jake55555

[For anyone else interested ](https://youtu.be/1DZi9MoaxTM)


ThinBraStraps

Slave story starts at 19:42


macaleaven

Narrator: _That is exactly what they did._


LuxNocte

I have blue eyes. People ask where they came from and I say "Well....my great great great great grandmother was a very pretty slave...and her owner had blue eyes." Then a flat look.


hillcrust

You only need about 2 greats. Sadly, It wasn’t that many generations ago.


LuxNocte

Oh, yeah...I forgot to subtract my parents and grandparents. 4 generations does not equal 4 greats.


bondmemebond_2

Somewhat similar story for me, I have a very common Portuguese surname although I'm Indian. The story behind it is that the Portuguese came to south India (specifically goa) and converted a lot of folks to Christianity. The state Im from is close so many people here also have Portuguese surname if Christian


apresmoiputas

I also learned of what the Portuguese did to the rock carvings on Elephanta Island between Mumbai and Navi Mumbai. That was fucked up of them


swingthatwang

The Portuguese and Spanish were just as brutal as the British and Dutch. I mean, they're literally imperialist colonialists so that's not surprising. Interestingly, the descendants of Spanish colonialists of Latin America, such as white Mexicans, get minority preference here in the States since they can claim Hispanic and/or Latino ethnicity. They're basically white with black hair, or sometimes blonde. You wouldn't know they were Hispanic or Latino unless they told you. Half the time they look Italian or black Irish, and half the time straight up Anglo. They basically get treated as white people in everyday life cuz well, they're white. But get legal preference in academia and hiring practices. It's a step away from the Elizabeth Warren "I'm 1/62 Cherokee" statement.


SassyStrawberry18

Maybe in the US, but in Mexico most of the snobby *whitexicans* who can say "my grandparents/great-grandparents were Spanish" aren't the descendants of ancient colonizers. They're the descendants of the communists and anarchists who fled Spain after they lost the Civil War to the nationalists in 1939. The Mexican government openly offered asylum to them as they were marketing the country as a post-revolutionary haven free from fascism. Most of the children of colonizers either returned to Spain filthy rich during the viceregal period, returned to Spain impoverished after the War of Independence and chaos of the early republics, or just integrated into the mestizo population.


macaleaven

Lemme guess, da Silva?


bondmemebond_2

Nah, but I'll give a hint, it starts as D' Edit: My surname actually starts as (D') with the apostrophe included


bowlbettertalk

D'Souza?


bondmemebond_2

Yep, you got it


JamalBruh

Dude, I knew an Indian girl in high school named D'Souza! I always thought it was an oddly Spanish-sounding last name for an Indian person (I was a dumb teenager, so the difference between Portuguese and Spanish was lost on me, lol), but we weren't close, so I never asked. I guess I just figured she was mixed, or something. TIL. Was it a forceful conversion, or nah?


apresmoiputas

In Portuguese it's actually "De Sousa" but pronounced "d Souza". It's basically a creolization of the actually name


ThePoliteCanadian

Hilarious, my ex’s mother is Maria De Sousa. The Jane Smith of Portugal. Her dad? John. John and Jane Smith. This isn’t a breach of privacy because good fucking luck finding a specific Portuguese Maria and John de Sousa.


Wireeeee

Dwight Schrute


apresmoiputas

Dos santos? De gamba?


sintos-compa

dude, i have no idea where portugese names start or end, like there's a reason why all the footballers have nicknames :P


JoBrosHoes93

I’ve been to England and went to the actual town where my families slave owners are from (Watford England trash football team) but boyfriend is Nigerian can’t wait to get his last name.


bob256k

I dont know why you roasting their football team had me rolling


BEETLEJUICEME

Doing ancestry.com as a [mostly] white person in the US is pretty scary. I grew up in deep poverty, and my people’s people did too— so as I traced stuff back and started approaching the generations before 1860 it was pretty clear none of them would have been the type of people capable (financially) of owning slaves. But then, each generation back after that you’re looking at twice as many possible slave owners… and sure enough, I did find exactly one. I think it’s a positive though that more folks are being forced to reckon with that kind of stuff because of the advances in lineage tracing that dna analysis allows. Side note: The documentary on HBO *Exterminate The Brutes* should be required viewing for every white person on earth IMHO.


Damn_Amazon

So this sort of parallels conversations I’ve had about women taking husband’s surnames, and how “it doesn’t matter since you have your dad’s name, you always have a man’s name.” No, the fact that it is my surname makes it a woman’s name. It is mine. Enslaved people and their descendants were left with the surnames put on them by their owners. Many say “that’s not your name, that’s a white name.” But in an important way, it’s a *black* name because it belongs to a black person.


jamesfigueroa01

Kind of boxed him in with that one lol


sintos-compa

shackled him up, if you will


jamesfigueroa01

Shit….you win, take the upvote


Kabusanlu

Same with Spanish last names


bearded_hokage_

he wasn't ready and alot of the country still isn't


hownowbrownmau

This comment bothers me in the same way that people overuse “we don’t deserve dogs” on Reddit. The whole “isn’t ready” thing is cringe. Moreover, it’s never been about readiness or preparedness, it’s willingness. The country isn’t willing.


Syrinx221

I've never interrupted that phrase to genuinely mean "not ready". More, "their minds are too closed off/defensive"


hownowbrownmau

That’s the thing, every “conversation” where you are informing people starts off this way. How many times in science has a big breakthrough been met with skepticism? It’s not new or unique, but you don’t just walk away defeated with a bullshit phrase like “but y’all not ready for this.” It’s sounds childish and stupid. Imagine when polio vaccine was discovered and no one wanted to talk about it hearing a scientist say “y’all not ready for that conversation” as their mic drop.


fbcmfb

My first and last names are completely African (both of my parents are Nigerian) so slavery with my ancestors isn’t known or obvious. My in-laws are jewish with a biblical history of slavery and documented expulsion from Spain, hundreds of years ago. My in-laws referred to me as slave though. They specifically used the Hebrew word for a slave - a word that they often use in jewish prayers verbalizing their oppressed history. Because of this post … I guess I need to prepare my kids (when attending Temple/Jewish school for the off comments they might get). Edit: “ebed” is the Hebrew word.


OGmapletits

I’m first gen American from Barbados. My father always said his dad was Irish. I thought he was joking just because he was an alcoholic. As I got older and started looking into our and the island’s history, I realized my dad was telling the truth.


fezhose

I get why this post is in r/BlackPeopleTwitter. What I don’t get is why it was in r/WhitePeopleTwitter earlier


Kingbuji

I just saw the post there. Man those guys get mad over little things.


Animegirl300

Maybe cuz white people need to hear it?


Smutasticsmut

And…they were probably also related too. Just sayin’


deadmelo

"Are you Scottish?" My Black Ass: Nigga are you fuckin serious?


MarvinLazer

I think this has probably happened to every white guy born before the 70s at least once.


cougar618

I mean, if you're light skinned then you might have gotten more than a name...


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FakeBeigeNails

what would the dialogue be…they both know about slavery, so there’s no “learning experience” missed out on…


sephraes

Open dialogue about a topic that everyone should already be fully aware of in the United States. No teenage needs to babytalk a high school teacher. Especially when her statement was 100% accurate.


amienona

Are you me?